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	<title>
	Comments on: Israel&#8217;s Record of Self-Investigation: Obvious to Anyone who Looked.	</title>
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	<lastBuildDate>Wed, 13 Apr 2011 19:57:54 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>
		By: Spoff		</title>
		<link>https://www.jwire.com.au/israels-record-of-self-investigation-obvious-to-anyone-who-looked/#comment-8010</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Spoff]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 13 Apr 2011 19:57:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.jwire.com.au/?p=16064#comment-8010</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[&quot;Israel has been forced to fight a number of wars&quot;

This widely held belief is the result of superior PR. No Historian of repute, Israeli or otherwise subscribes to it.

The Israeli Defence Forces Intelligen­ce Service document &quot;The Emigration of the Arabs of Palestine in the Period 1/12/1947/­- 1/6/1948&quot; reveals that of 391,000, 73% Palestinians had been driven from their homes by direct action of the Hagannah, Stern and Irgun. 
This is before the Arab League intervened. 
Martin van Creveld reveals that Yishuv forces as at 15 May outnumbered and outgunned the Arab League contingent and several months later, enjoyed a superiority in numbers of 1.5 to 1.0. (The Sword And The Olive, p. 77-78)

In 1956, Israel, in company with France and Britain attacked Egypt - unprovoked.

1967. Begin, Dayan and Peled have all confirmed what any close observer knew. Nasser did not want War and did what he could to avoid it:
http://www.ussliberty.org/orenbook.htm

It could be argued that Israel was subject to attack in 1973  but, given Israel&#039;s obduracy in settling matters arising out of 1967, that resumption of the 1967 War was inevitable.

Israel&#039;s attacks on Lebanon are not in dispute.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;Israel has been forced to fight a number of wars&#8221;</p>
<p>This widely held belief is the result of superior PR. No Historian of repute, Israeli or otherwise subscribes to it.</p>
<p>The Israeli Defence Forces Intelligen­ce Service document &#8220;The Emigration of the Arabs of Palestine in the Period 1/12/1947/­- 1/6/1948&#8221; reveals that of 391,000, 73% Palestinians had been driven from their homes by direct action of the Hagannah, Stern and Irgun.<br />
This is before the Arab League intervened.<br />
Martin van Creveld reveals that Yishuv forces as at 15 May outnumbered and outgunned the Arab League contingent and several months later, enjoyed a superiority in numbers of 1.5 to 1.0. (The Sword And The Olive, p. 77-78)</p>
<p>In 1956, Israel, in company with France and Britain attacked Egypt &#8211; unprovoked.</p>
<p>1967. Begin, Dayan and Peled have all confirmed what any close observer knew. Nasser did not want War and did what he could to avoid it:<br />
<a href="http://www.ussliberty.org/orenbook.htm" rel="nofollow ugc">http://www.ussliberty.org/orenbook.htm</a></p>
<p>It could be argued that Israel was subject to attack in 1973  but, given Israel&#8217;s obduracy in settling matters arising out of 1967, that resumption of the 1967 War was inevitable.</p>
<p>Israel&#8217;s attacks on Lebanon are not in dispute.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Stewart Mills		</title>
		<link>https://www.jwire.com.au/israels-record-of-self-investigation-obvious-to-anyone-who-looked/#comment-8009</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Stewart Mills]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 13 Apr 2011 10:00:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.jwire.com.au/?p=16064#comment-8009</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Raffe, there are many in the community jumping to the wrong conclusions about Goldstone&#039;s Op-Ed.  In no way was his piece a rejection or a recantation of the Report.  

Goldstone in his AP interview following his Op-Ed stated: &quot;As appears from the Washington Post article, information subsequent to publication of the report did meet with the view that one correction should be made with regard to intentionality on the part of Israel,&quot; the judge said. &quot;Further information as a result of domestic investigations could lead to further reconsideration, but as presently advised I have no reason to believe any part of the report needs to be reconsidered at this time.&quot;

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20110406/ap_on_re_mi_ea/ml_israel_un_report_5

To appreciate the failure of the civil and military just system to hold personnel to account read  B&#039;Tselem&#039;s : “Void of responsibility: Israeli Military Policy not to Investigate killings of Palestinians by Soldiers”. This report states since 29 September 2000 there have been more than 2,297 Palestinians who have been killed who had not taken part in hostilities against Israelis.  Prior to the second intifada the Military Police Investigation Unit would have investigated the killing of all Palestinians who were killed despite not taking part in hostilities. Now this is not the case. 

B’Tselem in 2006-2009 demanded the MPIU investigate 148 matters. The Judge Advocate General’s Office only ordered the MPIU to investigate 22 of these matters. The killing of Bassem Abu Rahmah is one such case that only occurred due to intense pressure from Israeli human rights groups like B’Tselem. However, again no person was found to account. Again the killing was labeled as an accident. Once is an accident, twice sure…but 2,297 accidental killings?

Not only are Palestinians being killed without a satisfactory explanation and appropriate persons being held to account, but internationals are also being killed. Rachel Corrie, Iain Hook, James Miller and UN personnel at UN Patrol base Khiam were all killed without anybody within the IDF being held to account. Tom Hurndall was a rare exception, in that someone was held to account. His killer served 6 years in prison, but this came after only extreme pressure of the family and British Government. Justice did not come as a matter of course but had to be demanded by the deceased’s families. Israelis too have been killed by Israeli security forces without someone being held to account. Asel Aslih (along with 12 other Palestinians Israelis) was killed in 2000 whilst taking part in demonstrations against Israeli actions in the Occupied Palestinian Territories. Internationals too have been shot at and received serious injuries: Brian Avery (face disfigurement), Tristan Anderson (physical and mental disability) and Emily Henchowitz (loss of an eye). Again there has been no person held to account for these actions.

Raffe you may think that Israel conducts investigations into these killings. However, B’Tselem, amongst others argues this is not the case, and that investigations only occur for exceptional cases which often means outside pressure. B&#039;Tselem&#039;s report clearly shows a substantial number of persons have been killed by IDF who have not taken part in hostilities and the IDF has failed to genuinely hold the perpetrators of the killing to account. The past decade has demonstrated a systematic failure in the Israeli civil and military justice system to account for the substantial amount of Palestinian fatalities occurring in the absence of hostilities to Israelis. Statements that suggest otherwise are not backed up by empirical evidence.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Raffe, there are many in the community jumping to the wrong conclusions about Goldstone&#8217;s Op-Ed.  In no way was his piece a rejection or a recantation of the Report.  </p>
<p>Goldstone in his AP interview following his Op-Ed stated: &#8220;As appears from the Washington Post article, information subsequent to publication of the report did meet with the view that one correction should be made with regard to intentionality on the part of Israel,&#8221; the judge said. &#8220;Further information as a result of domestic investigations could lead to further reconsideration, but as presently advised I have no reason to believe any part of the report needs to be reconsidered at this time.&#8221;</p>
<p><a href="http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20110406/ap_on_re_mi_ea/ml_israel_un_report_5" rel="nofollow ugc">http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20110406/ap_on_re_mi_ea/ml_israel_un_report_5</a></p>
<p>To appreciate the failure of the civil and military just system to hold personnel to account read  B&#8217;Tselem&#8217;s : “Void of responsibility: Israeli Military Policy not to Investigate killings of Palestinians by Soldiers”. This report states since 29 September 2000 there have been more than 2,297 Palestinians who have been killed who had not taken part in hostilities against Israelis.  Prior to the second intifada the Military Police Investigation Unit would have investigated the killing of all Palestinians who were killed despite not taking part in hostilities. Now this is not the case. </p>
<p>B’Tselem in 2006-2009 demanded the MPIU investigate 148 matters. The Judge Advocate General’s Office only ordered the MPIU to investigate 22 of these matters. The killing of Bassem Abu Rahmah is one such case that only occurred due to intense pressure from Israeli human rights groups like B’Tselem. However, again no person was found to account. Again the killing was labeled as an accident. Once is an accident, twice sure…but 2,297 accidental killings?</p>
<p>Not only are Palestinians being killed without a satisfactory explanation and appropriate persons being held to account, but internationals are also being killed. Rachel Corrie, Iain Hook, James Miller and UN personnel at UN Patrol base Khiam were all killed without anybody within the IDF being held to account. Tom Hurndall was a rare exception, in that someone was held to account. His killer served 6 years in prison, but this came after only extreme pressure of the family and British Government. Justice did not come as a matter of course but had to be demanded by the deceased’s families. Israelis too have been killed by Israeli security forces without someone being held to account. Asel Aslih (along with 12 other Palestinians Israelis) was killed in 2000 whilst taking part in demonstrations against Israeli actions in the Occupied Palestinian Territories. Internationals too have been shot at and received serious injuries: Brian Avery (face disfigurement), Tristan Anderson (physical and mental disability) and Emily Henchowitz (loss of an eye). Again there has been no person held to account for these actions.</p>
<p>Raffe you may think that Israel conducts investigations into these killings. However, B’Tselem, amongst others argues this is not the case, and that investigations only occur for exceptional cases which often means outside pressure. B&#8217;Tselem&#8217;s report clearly shows a substantial number of persons have been killed by IDF who have not taken part in hostilities and the IDF has failed to genuinely hold the perpetrators of the killing to account. The past decade has demonstrated a systematic failure in the Israeli civil and military justice system to account for the substantial amount of Palestinian fatalities occurring in the absence of hostilities to Israelis. Statements that suggest otherwise are not backed up by empirical evidence.</p>
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		<item>
		<title>
		By: Lynne Newington		</title>
		<link>https://www.jwire.com.au/israels-record-of-self-investigation-obvious-to-anyone-who-looked/#comment-8005</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Lynne Newington]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 13 Apr 2011 06:46:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.jwire.com.au/?p=16064#comment-8005</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Crimes against humanity and UN inquiries; hmmmmmmmm.
Geoffery Robertson QC knows all about that, someone should send them his most recent book.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Crimes against humanity and UN inquiries; hmmmmmmmm.<br />
Geoffery Robertson QC knows all about that, someone should send them his most recent book.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
		
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